@nhsportspage Twitter Feed
Top posting users this month


Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams

Go down

Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams Empty The problem with local publications

Post  boxout on Wed Mar 23, 2011 10:47 am

I first want to say that I very much enjoy reading NHNotebook, NHSportsPage, and WGAM (listening). The problem with all three of these media sources is that they are specifically Southern New Hampshire, or more specific anything 10 miles away from Nashua. Some of these publications have only seen those schools. I can bring every reporter in this area and tell you exactly what they cover. We all know that Tom King is the personal sports reporter for BG. We all know that Gary Fitz and Joe Marchelina (SP) cover mostly Milford. Gary for Telegraph, Joe for the Milford Cabinet, and NHHSsports. I respect all of these journalists and announcers, with that said you can bet your bottom dollar that not one of them has seen any team outside of their area. I would go as far as to say none of these reporters ever saw Pembroke, Hanover, Portsmouth, or Oyster River at home. The only time they have viewed these teams is at the home of Milford, Pelham, or Souhegan. I use last year as an example, Jake Woodward was DII basketball player of the year, was not even mentioned as Mr. Basketball by any or those sources for the state. Though they did have players who were first teamers in DII but not the player of the year in DII, of course they were all within 10 miles of Nashua.
You can say the exact thing about DI, you can bet that none of these reporters ever went to a game in Dover, Concord, or Salem. I know they have some seacoast reporters/insiders, however they are only covering one game, there are about 40 games a piece on Tuesday and Friday's, not the poster here. LOL
I also know that many of you only see the teams you support, and who they play that night. That is exactly why there is so much biased towards BG and Milford. I am the biggest Milford supporter there is, with that said, I try to be unbiased. Next year try taking in a Souhegan-Oyster River game instead of making that trek to see undefeated Milford play win less Sanborn.
Are you guys aware that when you type certain things you are downgrading those that made the team. How would you like to be Dimitri Floras or Kamahl Walker and read this forum. According to many of you they are just average players, that they are not. Both players have a chance to play DII college. Was the best point guard in the state self-titled or who made that up?

boxout
All-State
All-State

Posts : 256
Join date : 2010-03-03

Back to top Go down

Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams Empty Re: Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams

Post  EBlessNHSP on Wed Mar 23, 2011 12:17 pm

Boxout,

1st of all, I don't think ANYBODY is saying Floras, or Walker are "average" players. I haven't read that (but I skim a lot of these posts that are books so I may be wrong). Floras is obviously a phenomenal talent in NH, and Walker led his team to the title game (without him they were probably nowhere near it this year). Including somebody on 1st team and either removing another guy is just debate, bottom line is all these kids that make a Newspaper 1st team, NHIAA, NHCBO etc team are great players in our State. The line between 1st and 2nd team is blurry at best...

Now - as far as media outlets covering regional games, etc. what you need to understand is MOST of those media outlets ONLY cover their region. And yes, they only cover the games that are played at home in their area due to costs to operate newspapers, etc. It makes no sense for Gary Fitz to go learn about DII and cover Oyser River at Portsmouth because 1, his readers don't care, and 2 he knows the Portsmouth Herald will be there and can read about it in the morning himself. Not to mention costs, etc. When the Telegraph names its "Mr. Basketball" it names it for the Greater Nashua region, not the entire State of NH.

There are only 2 websites that cover NH Sports from Division to Division, North to South, and that's NHSportsPage.com, and Jeremy's Blog. The funny part about this whole conversation is that those two information sources are the ONLY ones not operating on a large budget. In fact, most of the time they operate on their own dime I would imagine. So cut them some slack, because their content is FREE, unlike the Union Leaders (who charge you to read most the articles on their website) and many of the other papers. The other papers also get funds in from distribution.

And yes they primarily cover DI and DII (but both do get to DIII and DIV games) because that is where the readers are. When you develop a product, you don't develop for the outer rim, you focus on the largest conglomerate of customers, the center so to speak. Why would Dave Haley go see ten DIV games if his readership is centered in Nashua, Manchester and Portsmouth. And yes, he knows that based on all of your IP addresses (just like I know 50% of you are from Greater Nashua, 30% from Greater Manchester and 15% from Greater Portsmouth and 5% everywhere else.)

I think instead of spouting off about how nobody covers the State you should A. Start a website and see how easy it is to get to all these games or B. Give credit where credit is due and be happy somebody is doing it at all.

_________________
NH Sports Forum Administrator
EBlessNHSP
EBlessNHSP
Admin

Posts : 1705
Join date : 2009-01-21
Age : 39
Location : Fremont, NH

http://nhsportspage.com/index.php

Back to top Go down

Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams Empty Re: Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams

Post  EBlessNHSP on Wed Mar 23, 2011 12:21 pm

Just one more thing to add - all you have to do is read the threads and posts in this forum to understand why most media outlets don't cover anything north of Concord (or even Concord for that matter). Good luck finding any interested posters following DIII or DIV on the forum today. I hope that changes in the future (if it does we might go back to splitting the forum sections up by division) but for now, it's a DI and DII Southern NH world. Until the readers/posters etc from the north start coming to the various sites listed above, it will stay that way.

I think you see Dave and Jeremy putting feelers out there covering what they can up North in the smaller divisions, but I don't think either will focus efforts until the interest is really there.

_________________
NH Sports Forum Administrator
EBlessNHSP
EBlessNHSP
Admin

Posts : 1705
Join date : 2009-01-21
Age : 39
Location : Fremont, NH

http://nhsportspage.com/index.php

Back to top Go down

Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams Empty Sorry

Post  boxout on Wed Mar 23, 2011 12:42 pm

I think you misunderstood me. I am very appreciative of their jobs and the information they supply. With that said, there is no need to cover 15 South/North games and ignore teams that are having better seasons. I agree with costs, however it doesn't cost that much to travel to any part of this state. I understand the entire situation of covering where their readers are, it makes total sense. The point is if you haven't seen any team other than the home team all season long (BG,Milford), how much do you really know about any other team? These reporters are putting teams together on teams that they never have seen play. Again how many of these reporters saw games in Hanover or Lebanon? Do you not think a bias is created when these reporters are seeing the same exact team over and over again? Of course their is. I am not saying they need to cover every single game. But if BG is playing Concord at home (down year), you could easily find another game to cover. It makes for a more well rounded reporter. I couldn't believe the coverage for North/South they had disappointing season and got coverage that one would think they are in the running for a state championship. Traveling to see Souhegan play another top DII school should not be that big of an expense. To be completely honest the Telegraph should be concerned about all of their readers not just Nashua, that is probably why the Telegraph is in serious financial trouble. I don't bother reading about North losing by 30 to some other school in Manchester. I would be willing to bet that 4 win teams are not being followed nearly as much as you think.
I will admit that the Telegraph does do an All-Area team, but of course their will be 8 BG kids, 6 Milford kids, and 5 from Souhegan, and the list goes on. Sometimes I read their All-Area team and think to myself, the lists would be shorter if you put who did not make the team.
I was talking about WGAM and Woodward last year.
The Assistant I respect your knowledge and information, I also respect anyone who covers NH Sports, I really do. I just don't know if I trust writers when it comes to selecting All-State teams. They have not seen 50% of the states teams. And usually always on the road.
I also understand your point about the Portsmouth Herald being at a game in Portsmouth, you aren't telling me because some other newspaper is around the Telegraph shouldn't cover a game? Of course they should. You still have the same readers at home as on the road.


boxout
All-State
All-State

Posts : 256
Join date : 2010-03-03

Back to top Go down

Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams Empty Re: Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams

Post  EBlessNHSP on Wed Mar 23, 2011 2:12 pm

Fair response Boxout...

First, let me ask you a question, do you purchase the Portsmouth Herald daily? Or Fosters Democrat?

If you answered no, then you are part of the reason why John Doyle does not come to Nashua for the South/Dover game every year, or North/Spaulding (He did however cover the Spaulding/BG playoff game IN NASHUA this year if you look back at their archives). Instead, Mr. Doyle (who does an excellent job I might add) will commonly be found at the area home game, whether it be basketball, hockey, indoor track, etc. which headlines (or sometimes doesn't) that evenings home docket. It just doesn't make financial sense for the Democrat to send him 2 hours south to a game. Nor do they want him up till 3am typing a story that is due by 11pm for Print. Just doesn't work for the paper publications.

Now Haley and his team of writers (myself included) have a little more freedom since it's an online publication. We can head out to a game 2 hours away if its the best game of the night. Get home, write till midnight or 1am and publish it up immediately. FWIW when I cover a game (I know I only did a couple this year) he gives me my choice, and because I don't want to be up till 1am I typically choose games close, Oyster River, Pinkerton, Sanborn, Manchester, Portsmouth, etc. I don't like driving more than a 1/2 hour and nobody else does either.

Next, you state you don't think writers are qualified to pick all state teams. Well, in this state they don't. The coaches do.

The writers select their teams for their private publications. Dave Haley picks his All-State team, that's NHSportsPage's opinion. Same for Telegraph (one would assume they pool their knowledge, Fitz, King etc) and so on. These publications/websites are free to do what they want, they've sold newspapers, or advertising, built a loyal readership who respect their opinion. If for some reason you don't agree with their picks, you can discontinue your paper, or stop clicking on their website as a means to no longer support their publication or website.

I think the bottom line here is the print papers just can't financially afford to send reporters to cover games away from home, AND with our state being spread out as it is, getting articles done in time for Print can be challenging.

Obviously exceptions are made around playoff time (I've seen Fitz all over the State) or maybe a really big game between two undefeateds or something. 9 times out of 10 though the print reporters will stay close to home.

_________________
NH Sports Forum Administrator
EBlessNHSP
EBlessNHSP
Admin

Posts : 1705
Join date : 2009-01-21
Age : 39
Location : Fremont, NH

http://nhsportspage.com/index.php

Back to top Go down

Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams Empty Ok Assistant

Post  boxout on Wed Mar 23, 2011 3:07 pm

I understand about a newspaper being able to pick any team they want. Never questioned that. What I am questioning is the legitimacy of these teams. Should writers be picking All-State teams, when they have not seen half the state? You admitted it in your post that most writers don't see every team.
I love following HS sports, it is great stuff. It doesn't mean that I have to support every single thing that is done by NHIAA or writers. I am sorry if I stepped on your toes, I had no idea you were a writer.
I can understand reading other sites newspapers and getting a feel for a team, but do you really have your own feel for a team? Or a feel for a team that some writer has a feel about? I don't subscribe to the Portsmouth Herald, I do read it on line occasionally.
I also am fully aware that I can stop reading or subscribing to any of these entities. I feel you are trying to insult me, by not realizing that I know I can do that.
I don't know maybe it should be a combination of writers and coaches. I do know one thing, it can't be a fan vote.
Once again very few of these selections are perfect, I just think it can be done a lot better. Someone mentioned adding a player to make it 7, the responses are dead on, 7 becomes 8, 8 becomes 9, and so on. That was my point about the NHIAA's All-State teams, way too many are on it.

boxout
All-State
All-State

Posts : 256
Join date : 2010-03-03

Back to top Go down

Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams Empty Re: Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams

Post  Guest on Wed Mar 23, 2011 3:18 pm

I don't think you understand what The Assistant is saying, the actual All-State teams are picked by the coaches not the writers. The media outlets such as the Telegraph pick an All-Area team so it really doesn't matter what a player on the Seacost or Up North are doing because it's all area, and who other than Gary Fitz, Joe M, etc would know about the Nashua Area than them, so yes they're qualified to pick this area's, All-Area team. The Sportspage, and nhnotebook are both unofficial but like Assistant said they cover pretty much every division.

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams Empty BigMan

Post  boxout on Wed Mar 23, 2011 3:21 pm

I understand the Telegraph is all area, but some of those other publications are picking All-State teams.

boxout
All-State
All-State

Posts : 256
Join date : 2010-03-03

Back to top Go down

Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams Empty Re: Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams

Post  Guest on Wed Mar 23, 2011 3:24 pm

Such as? Because I generally read all the sports sections in all the outlets and have never noticed all-state teams most are all-area, now I may be wrong.

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams Empty Sorry BigMan

Post  boxout on Wed Mar 23, 2011 3:43 pm

You need to read all the posts.

boxout
All-State
All-State

Posts : 256
Join date : 2010-03-03

Back to top Go down

Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams Empty I did...

Post  Guest on Wed Mar 23, 2011 3:47 pm

I did.......I'll go through them again but don't think I'm going to find anything different.

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams Empty I guess you missed mine

Post  boxout on Wed Mar 23, 2011 3:51 pm

I admitted that the Telegraph is all-area. I said that the list will include 8 BG players, 6 from Milford, 5 from Souhegan, then scatter the rest.

boxout
All-State
All-State

Posts : 256
Join date : 2010-03-03

Back to top Go down

Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams Empty Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams

Post  EBlessNHSP on Wed Mar 23, 2011 5:08 pm

bigman44 wrote:I don't think you understand what The Assistant is saying, the actual All-State teams are picked by the coaches not the writers. The media outlets such as the Telegraph pick an All-Area team so it really doesn't matter what a player on the Seacost or Up North are doing because it's all area, and who other than Gary Fitz, Joe M, etc would know about the Nashua Area than them, so yes they're qualified to pick this area's, All-Area team. The Sportspage, and nhnotebook are both unofficial but like Assistant said they cover pretty much every division.

Thank you Bigman. That is exactly what I was trying to say. (not much of a writer I guess, eh).

Boxout - if there are publications (outside of NHSP and NHNB) that are picking TRUE entire state all-state teams then I 100% agree with you. Because I KNOW all the other papers in the State, Concord Monitor, Nashua Telegraph, Portsmouth Herald, Laconia Citizen, Fosters, etc. etc. etc are ONLY covering their home teams when they're playing home games (outside of the playoffs). You argument is spot on if the Portsmouth Herald is picking a 1st teamer from Hanover, because there is no way he's seen them more than the 1 time they played Portsmouth HS in Portsmouth.

I know, because I periodically write for Dave Haley, that him, myself and Tarrier all get our info from each other, and the coaching staffs we talk regularly.

Coaches do the SAME thing, regularly. When I coached at Alvirne we'd play Trinity and later that night Bonney would be on the horn with Keefe talking about Central who we were to play the following week. Coaching is interesting like that, even though you're going against a guy one night, the next night he's spilling his guts how to beat another guy (particularly in Trinitys case when you play Central the following week).

You said you want the fans to vote? Well if we allowed that then the DI first team would have been filled with 5 BG starters and DII with 5 Milford starters (I'm exaggerating but you get my point). Who's more fair than coaches who have to prepare for these kids games night in and night out. Who's more in tune with what's going on in the NH HS basketball scene then the Adults who are LIVING IT. The coaches are, and will always be the best representative voters for All-State, Division etc Teams.

Please don't take this the wrong way - yes I'm biased since I write for NHSP (surprised you didn't know that by now - my name is Eliot Bless). I'm just trying to understand why you think the system is so flawed. So far you've mentioned that you don't think the writers/coaches should chose the teams. Your only solution was to have the fans do it. Sorry that isn't going to work either. Basketball

_________________
NH Sports Forum Administrator
EBlessNHSP
EBlessNHSP
Admin

Posts : 1705
Join date : 2009-01-21
Age : 39
Location : Fremont, NH

http://nhsportspage.com/index.php

Back to top Go down

Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams Empty Re: Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams

Post  EBlessNHSP on Wed Mar 23, 2011 5:17 pm

I split this out b/c there were 2 conversations going on in the All-State thread...

_________________
NH Sports Forum Administrator
EBlessNHSP
EBlessNHSP
Admin

Posts : 1705
Join date : 2009-01-21
Age : 39
Location : Fremont, NH

http://nhsportspage.com/index.php

Back to top Go down

Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams Empty The Assistant

Post  boxout on Wed Mar 23, 2011 5:21 pm

I never said it should be fan. You are putting words in my mouth.

boxout
All-State
All-State

Posts : 256
Join date : 2010-03-03

Back to top Go down

Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams Empty Re: Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams

Post  Guest on Wed Mar 23, 2011 5:22 pm

The Assistant wrote:
Thank you Bigman. That is exactly what I was trying to say. (not much of a writer I guess, eh).

:

Lol I paraphrased you so I guess you're still the writer, but I don't think we were all on the same page as boxout I think he was talking about WGAM/Mr. Basketball but I'm not sure still.

Guest
Guest


Back to top Go down

Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams Empty Re: Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams

Post  EBlessNHSP on Wed Mar 23, 2011 7:03 pm

boxout wrote:I never said it should be fan. You are putting words in my mouth.

My bad Boxout it must have been someone else.

_________________
NH Sports Forum Administrator
EBlessNHSP
EBlessNHSP
Admin

Posts : 1705
Join date : 2009-01-21
Age : 39
Location : Fremont, NH

http://nhsportspage.com/index.php

Back to top Go down

Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams Empty Do I want to throw myself in here????

Post  Tulliver on Wed Mar 23, 2011 7:18 pm

Hmmmm 51% yes 49% no.

Okay.... I got irritated last year about the Mr Basketball conversation because of similar sentiments echoed here and throughout the Queen City..... so allow me a moment on my soapbox.

If an organization wants to give out an award... or pick a team.... they set the standards on their own and have every right to do so.

People can disagree... people can agree... people can refuse to support the organization... but regardless... THEY SET UP THE RECOGNITION - it's their call.

I address this to no one poster - so no one feel I am doing such...

But, it is what it is.

Perfect system... nope... but there are rules and standards which are followed.

Embarassed


Last edited by Tulliver on Wed Mar 23, 2011 7:18 pm; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : embarrassing grammatical error)

Tulliver
Moderator

Posts : 531
Join date : 2009-04-05

Back to top Go down

Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams Empty Re: Newspaper/Publications Picking All-Star Teams

Post  Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum