@nhsportspage Twitter Feed
Top posting users this month


Floras back in town

Page 2 of 5 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

View previous topic View next topic Go down

Re: Floras back in town

Post  Tulliver on Thu Nov 24, 2011 9:27 am

I don't think it's a transfer issue either -

I think it comes down to, if the past quarter of work counts for NHIAA eligibilty as it may be seen as sophomore not junior.

It's just an odd situation that will have to be hammered out by TPTB.

I don't think it's personal at all - I don't think speculation is about Dimitri as a person or player or about either of the institutions.

I think the whole thing comes down to - wow, how does that work as it's a different situation that does not clearly fit the protocols for NHIAA.

Take for example a kid say a senior - who might not be eligible due to grades earned in SR classes.
If another senior became eligible using junior classes - that were already taken - then we can see where a fairness rule could come into play.

However, it should be noted that ANY player could earn eligibility with courses that are not their "grade year".
Let's say a freshman basketball player failed second semester 9th grade math and is retaking that as his sophomore semester 1 math class. If he earns a passing grade - then it counts towards his 4 units of study with a passing grade.
The key here - is that he is not retaking something he already passed.

Where the prep thing becomes interesting - and tricky - is not about transferring but in the academics. If one reclassifies he or she takes classes that may very well have been passed in public school. So, they - most likely - wouldn't count again in a transfer case.

Again - I want to say that I sincerely believe that Merrimack is a very reputable school district and I think they will dot the i's and cross the t's.

It is so interesting because it's such an unusual circumstance.
(Floras is also an interesting player to watch - I don' think anyone will deny it'd be great to get to see him play again as well)

Tulliver
Moderator

Posts : 531
Join date : 2009-04-05

Back to top Go down

JAF and Tully

Post  boxout on Thu Nov 24, 2011 10:35 am

I agree with you on the academic side of this issue. There are probably major issues in this area.
But one thing all of you seem to be ignoring is this players transfer was for athletics not for education, I think we all can clearly see that, you have to be completely naive to not think that. You both stated (I think) that Merrimack has a high educational criteria, and is a good school. So then explain to me why he went to Kimball U? If Merrimack offers such a good education, then there was no need to transfer, other than for athletics. Not saying Tully and JAF, but people who support him playing this year for Merrimack have no respect for a player's academics, it is all about sport. Let's be honest, many Prep schools that take in athletes, are not taking in athletes that have 3.5 or higher. There is no need for it. Many of these Prep schools are for students that need education, at a slower pace and more reduced student size classes. Many of these schools, trust me not all, are for developmentally challenged or anger challenged students. Many have a tough time in a normal HS setting, whether it be grades, maturity, or getting into trouble. Please understand I am talking about students who transfer and have not graduated from a Public or Private HS. I get the whole 5th year Senior thing for Prep school, it bothers me, but hey it is legal.
I also feel that something else is being left out, how about scholarship for this school? Did his parents pay for him to go there? I bet they didn't. I bet this kid got a full ride and now is going back to Public school. A parent who is paying for this out of there own pocket would make their child finish at least the semester or trimester.
I agree that this is not about Dimitri it is about the rules and bending of rules for athletics. It is a private matter, but not anymore. it was private when he decided to leave Merrimack, now it is public because Dimitri has asked for it. Are we really going to have the Floras Rule now in HS and Prep sports? I also tend to agree with T@F that his parents did talk with the NHIAA about their son being able to play this year. However, my feeling on that is that the parents should be worried about their sons grades and academic performance before athletics. The last thing they should be worried about is sports.
I find this situation a little hazy, we are missing something, what I don't know.
Like I said earlier, did he get into trouble at Kimball U? Maybe not. But if he didn't, then he realized that he would not be playing that much at Kimball U., and that is why he is back at Merrimack.

boxout
All-State
All-State

Posts : 256
Join date : 2010-03-03

Back to top Go down

Re: Floras back in town

Post  Tulliver on Thu Nov 24, 2011 10:44 am

My statement about Merrimack was meant that Merrimack will not sacrifice academic integrity to accept courses that do not pass academic muster.

I will not assume anything as to why anyone transfers. I know plenty of people who transfer schools for a host of reasons that might appear to be athletic and in actuality are motivated by much more complex and personal things.

I do not know the Floras family and will not speculate on why or what motivated his decisions.

I think we need to step back and handle this situation about rules and policies without speculating about factors involving any teenager and his decisions.

Not to sound like the forum hall monitor but there are specific terms of use regarding such matters.

Tulliver
Moderator

Posts : 531
Join date : 2009-04-05

Back to top Go down

Re: Floras back in town

Post  JAF on Thu Nov 24, 2011 11:24 am


I totally disagree with the assertion that "now it is public because Dimitri has asked for it". I don't believe it should be any of our concern - the reasons for going to and returning from a private school aren't any of our business. I cannot imagine there was this grand plan to go to a prep school for 2-3 months and then "reappear" on the scene to make Merrimack HS basketball the prohibitive favorite to win the NH Division 1 championship. This probably was more of an "oh **** moment" than anything else. Speculating in a public blog on our part for those reasons is a slippery slope. Whether or not the question was asked at the time of leaving and reclassifying what are the consequences of returning - who knows.

If there isn't already a rule to handle the Floras type case, then you can bet there will be. I know prep schools aren't a new phenomena, but the money and stigma associated with them now certainly does make one go 'hmmm....'. Whether athletics was the only reason for the Floras' decision is pure speculation. I'm guessing it played a role - after all playing in a more competitive league should have only helped his chances to better his scholarship offers. Coming back for whatever reason I cannot believe was "in the plan". Is it hazy - sure. But as long as he comes back as a Junior - does it really matter that much to anyone in the "grand scheme of things"? That still leaves the only question of academic eligibility - which differs between school districts and what the NHIAA requirements are. I'm guessing summer school is in the plan. The reality is as I understand the NHIAA policies, he only has 4 years of NHIAA eligibility - regardless of what grade he returns at. If I remember correctly there's an age limit too - there was someone at BG a couple years ago who left and then thought about returning, but he would have been 19 during the season and thus the NHIAA said he couldn't return to either sport. A few years ago Souhegan girls hockey lost their only goalie, they tried to get an 8th grader to be declared eligible, but were denied because of the 4 year eligibility thing.

I'm not saying it's the case in this situation, but sometimes parents realize too late that they sent their child off to 1st grade as soon as he/she was eligible rather than waiting a year until perhaps they were ready. Another player I know who graduated a couple of years ago - the parents decided to have the player "repeat" 7th grade at a different school. Yes, athletically it helped eventually, but academically and socially the player truly benefited from the extra year.


JAF
Player of the Year
Player of the Year

Posts : 730
Join date : 2011-01-08

Back to top Go down

Re: Floras back in town

Post  Tuesday and Friday on Thu Nov 24, 2011 12:02 pm

Wow, Happy Thanksgiving morning to the Forum. I had to go munch a couple of choco chip cookies from the batch my wife told me last night.....

"Not to even think about touching"

..... to get the energy to read the new posts on this thread. Here I was posting about the "feathers flying" in the Merrimack School District next week and there's "feathers flying" on the Forum on Thanksgiving morning.

OK, I'm a guy who cuts right to the heart of the matter, so Tully and Jaf, you will receive a PM from me shortly concerning this thread.

Tuesday and Friday
Moderator

Posts : 3866
Join date : 2009-10-12

Back to top Go down

Re: Floras back in town

Post  goldenbear on Thu Nov 24, 2011 2:06 pm

I am not sure Merrimack is the reputable of a school district as some think, the 4 players who got in trouble last year missed the minimum amount of time for a first offense according to the NHIAA policy. Then you take a district like Nashua who 4 years ago suspended their best all around player for 30 days when they had a shot a title on his first offense.
I am almost positive the Floras family worked out the eligibility before they made the move, that only makes sense that they did and I am glad he is back playing in the NHIAA and maybe he will go on to a DIV scholarship. Because I am for one sick of these kids going prep early I dont mind the 5th year prep to get your grades up or mature physically but as being a selfish fan I miss out seeing Kaleb Joesph play for South or Ben Judson playing for Timberlane.

I would love to see Bell play for years at Brady and I hope it happens but I dont count on it.

goldenbear
All-State
All-State

Posts : 371
Join date : 2009-10-06

Back to top Go down

Re: Floras back in town

Post  Tuesday and Friday on Thu Nov 24, 2011 2:24 pm

G-Bear, the Jourdain Bell situation is still interesting. He moved from Alton to play at Rundlett in Concord a couple of years ago. He was going to Concord, then played for Memorial in summer league for a few games. All of a sudden he's not playing for Memorial and announced he's attending Bishop Brady. He plays AAU ball for Bishop Elite which has Memorial ties with JV coach Sudi Lett running the BE program. It's just an interesting story about a very talented soon to be NH high school basketball player who hasn't played HS basketball yet.

Here is an interesting article about Bell from the Concord Monitor:

http://www.concordmonitor.com/article/235726/skys-the-limit?page=0,0&CSAuthResp=1322155552%3A44urejtg47lgt3a60ocp5o95o1%3ACSUserId%7CCSGroupId%3Aapproved%3A2D566D9EFDB7E17B8BE928A3421D5EBF&CSUserId=94&CSGroupId=1


Last edited by Tuesday and Friday on Thu Nov 24, 2011 2:26 pm; edited 1 time in total

Tuesday and Friday
Moderator

Posts : 3866
Join date : 2009-10-12

Back to top Go down

Can I be basic...

Post  boxout on Thu Nov 24, 2011 2:26 pm

The problem I have is that, I do think it violates every intent of every rule involved with HS/Prep sports. You are right guys when you tell me it is none of my business, then why are we even discussing it? Why is Jeremy reporting it, or any other media outlet? Forum included. I didn't start this post. I just like to deal with facts that are involved. With the way athletics are handled at all levels is wrong. I am sorry the average student with a 2.9 is not getting a 5th year of education free, to improve their chances of becoming America's great scientist, or inventor.
The biggest problem I have and we can take all the politics out of it. One kid at Merrimack will not being playing basketball this year, because the STAR player made a mistake. One kid is not happy today on Thanksgiving. Guys put yourself as that 13th man or 12th whatever. You are now not playing, I know this person wouldn't start, would get garbage minutes, blah,blah,blah. But I bet this kid probably played summer league, fall league, trying to get better knowing that a roster spot has opened. Now that spot is gone. What do you tell that one kid? Trust me draw up any situation you want, one kid is not playing basketball at Merrimack this year, no matter what level of cuts you talk about.
As a coach, and there is a legend there, do you take the kid back this year? Leave out the NHIAA, but as a program and an example, do you let him play? There are personal feelings here, and not just with the Floras family.

boxout
All-State
All-State

Posts : 256
Join date : 2010-03-03

Back to top Go down

Playing time

Post  basketballtime on Thu Nov 24, 2011 10:04 pm

Boxout you said this earlier. Now that spot is gone. What do you tell that one kid? What you tell him is there is Lot's of ifs and maybes in life but no definites and that is just the way life is. Is it always fair? No but you can only control certain things in life and being guaranteed a spot on a high school basketball team is not one of them Just as much as it is for a challenged student going to Harvard.. My other question is why does it bother you that kids do a fifth year? Like you said some kids are challenged academically or for that matter physically or maturity wise so if they can get one more year to have a chance at a scholarship and furthering their academic career what bother's you about that? Would you prefer they drop out of school? I don't get where your coming from sorry?

basketballtime
All-State
All-State

Posts : 259
Join date : 2010-03-16

Back to top Go down

Re: Floras back in town

Post  Jeremy Leveille on Fri Nov 25, 2011 1:07 am

Why did I report it? Really? Do you really have to ask that question? Umm, maybe for the same reason I reported Kaleb Joseph transferred from South to Cushing, or when I reported Mike Stys transferring from New Haven to SNHU, or when I reported Mike Auger transferring from Hopkinton to New Hampton, etc. Whether they're switching college programs, going from prep to NHIAA or the other way around, star basketball players transferring somewhere is newsworthy, especially someone like Floras who is the best player in the NHIAA. And excuse me, but my article said NOTHING about grades, what classes he was taking at Kimball Union, if he got into trouble, etc. THAT is the stuff that is NOBODY'S business except Floras and his family. Whether he's going to KUA or Merrimack, the pros and cons of prep school, how the transfer will affect the balance of power in D-I - these are things that have to do with BASKETBALL and it's ok to discuss, this is what my article was about. My source who is VERY close to Floras (they asked to remain anonymous and I respected their wishes) confirmed the transfer with me, they said he wasn't happy at KUA because he felt secluded and he's happy to be back home and attending Merrimack. That's it. Why can't we just leave it at that and leave anything else out of it? Bringing up grades or anything else that is non-basketball related is inappropriate and disrespectful to Floras and his family.

And as for it being unfair to the kid who might get cut from the team because Floras is back - guess what, that's life. Before the start of my 8th grade year we had a star basketball player move to our district from Ohio. He ended up starting over me in high school. He was our best player, scored 40 points one game, while I saw limited minutes as the back up. I would have started if he never moved here. But guess what, that's life! If he had moved back to Ohio right before the start of his junior season he would have been starting in place of someone else over there and there would have been another kid who got cut because he moved back, that's life! Dimitri made the decision to transfer to KUA, he thought it was the right thing to do at the time. But after he was there for a few months he decided prep school wasn't for him so he came back to Merrimack. He just changed his mind and wants to be where he is most happy - there's nothing wrong with that! So it's not Dimitri's fault if now that he's back at Merrimack Bryan Courtemanche will now be the 6th man instead of being the starting 2 guard, and it's not his fault is some other kid ends of on JV instead of varsity.

Jeremy Leveille
All-State
All-State

Posts : 101
Join date : 2009-04-12
Location : Portsmouth, NH

http://www.nhnotebook.com

Back to top Go down

Honesty is still the best policy.

Post  GNG on Fri Nov 25, 2011 8:40 am

I disagree with you Jeremy. A student still needs passing grades to compete, even in Merrimack. Most people commenting on here are trying to figure out how that can happen if a kid leaves halfway thru a semester in a grade that he was repeating.

You opened the other can of worms by writing the reason he was leaving was homesickness. All of us on here are yahoo bloggers, but you went to college for this. I love reading your stuff, but I hold you to a higher standard then us. A much higher standard.

If memory serves you had no problem reporting all the off court issues with those 2 knucleheads at Winnie 2 seasons ago.

GNG
All-American
All-American

Posts : 1448
Join date : 2010-11-03

Back to top Go down

Re: Floras back in town

Post  Tulliver on Fri Nov 25, 2011 8:55 am

Goldenbear - I mentioned academic standards and your example is clearly athletic. Therefore, and I say this with respect, I stand by statement and do not think your example counters mine.

NHIAA policies often bow to school district policies. I haven't read Merrimack's policy about behavior off the court - but it is really their policy that would have to be evaluated. There is a great difference in different school district policies regarding athletes and conduct.
Soapbox moment - if people really care about these decisions - then I strongly urge you to consider that during elections. Coaches & administrators cannot make hard decisions without school boards who will support them. Let's think back to Nashua 10 years ago or so and two alumni (now lawyers) coming in to spearhead a re-writing of the policy because some kids got caught in it.

Some schools teach Health Freshman year and some sophomore year. It is quite possible a student in prep at the start of this year who reclassified might have courses that can be accepted at a public school in the old classified year.
HYPOTHETICAL It's also possible that a Public School Athlete from School A playing as a junior who has ALWAYS been at School A is taking freshmen English because he failed it twice before but passed enough other classes to play every year. That freshmen class - being taken now as a Junior - if he's passing counts towards his eligibility to play this year.

Boxout - I say this with respect, truly I do - but you say you want facts but use words that you have "gut feelings".

I think eligibility issues in regards to policy is interesting because this is an unusual case. But it would be just as interesting, from that standpoint, if the kid was John Smith and not Floras.

Anything personal about his life - in my opinion - doesn't belong here - and I haven't seen anything in the forum rules that suggests to me otherwise.

I've known kids who transfer home from prep and college because they're homesick, or they miss their girlfriend.


Tulliver
Moderator

Posts : 531
Join date : 2009-04-05

Back to top Go down

Re: Floras back in town

Post  Tuesday and Friday on Fri Nov 25, 2011 9:14 am

Jeremy,

I totally agree with your thoughts on "that's life" and nothing being a lock on a position or a slot on a team. Correct me if I'm wrong, but try outs haven't even started for any HS team in the state yet, so NOTHING is a lock for ANY boys or girls high school team this morning or this coming weekend. The jostling for positions and making teams begin next week.

You said you have a source very close to the Floras Family who said the reason he is coming back is he "felt secluded."



Interesting..........................................

Tuesday and Friday
Moderator

Posts : 3866
Join date : 2009-10-12

Back to top Go down

Re: Floras back in town

Post  Tulliver on Fri Nov 25, 2011 9:21 am

Girls tryouts were last week Smile


Tulliver
Moderator

Posts : 531
Join date : 2009-04-05

Back to top Go down

Re: Floras back in town

Post  Tuesday and Friday on Fri Nov 25, 2011 9:39 am

Yea, you're right Tully.

You're like an angel on my Forum shoulder.

Tuesday and Friday
Moderator

Posts : 3866
Join date : 2009-10-12

Back to top Go down

Trimester ans benefits of a 5th year

Post  bb603 on Fri Nov 25, 2011 10:31 am

KUA is on a trimester set-up. The first trimester has finished so he is not leaving in the middle of a quarter.

But, the is all about basketball, nothing academic. He went to KUA to play basketball and is coming back the Merrimack for basketball.


I would like to see some facts on kids who went to a prep school for a 5th year of HS and where they went to college after that 5th year. Did it significantly improve the college they went to?

I beleive there is a football player who did a year of prep school after 4 years in HS and then ended up at UNH as a backup on the football team. From what I know of the student and the family he did not need prep school for academics. I'm sure he would have gotten into UNH and many other fine schools with no year of prep scholl. So, how did that extra year benefit him in that case?

bb603
Varsity
Varsity

Posts : 62
Join date : 2011-04-20

Back to top Go down

Re: Floras back in town

Post  JAF on Fri Nov 25, 2011 11:06 am


bb603: A football team only gets so many slots every year to recruit. Perhaps that players position already had a player at it, but the school wanted the player bad enough that they "suggested" a prep year and then slotted that player in their next class.

goldenbear: A couple years ago my son was dating someone in the nashua hs system... she said that one of the star players never went to class, roamed the hallways, everyone knew, but no one did anything about it. so nashua isn't immune to looking the other way.

I agree the "last player cut" or the "PG to be" could have parents that are upset by this - the question is are they going to stir the hornets nest? In their hometown? As far as anyone is concerned, this player is a Junior by NHIAA standards. If getting on track to graduate with his class requires extra work by the student - well that's not the NHIAA's business. I'm sure there will be those that blame the NHIAA for allowing this. In the end though it's the Mmk school board and administration that are using their policies to decide what the student "needs" to do to return to school and play for the school team based on existing policies. Whether the rest of us like it or agree matters little in the long run. I can only imagine gyms across D1 will be packed to the rafters with students more than happy to chant their thoughts on the matter. Twisted Evil

JAF
Player of the Year
Player of the Year

Posts : 730
Join date : 2011-01-08

Back to top Go down

Re: Floras back in town

Post  Tuesday and Friday on Fri Nov 25, 2011 11:12 am

bb603, thanks for the item that KUA is on tri-mesters and the first one has finished.

When did the tri-mester at KUA finish. If you follow the timeline Floras was back in Merry a couple of weeks ago. My son goes to an upper education school where they are on tri-mesters also. His tri-mester finished Thursday November 17th.

One would think if a tri-mester wasn't completed at one school and some one transfers to another school then there is a concrete issue there.

Tuesday and Friday
Moderator

Posts : 3866
Join date : 2009-10-12

Back to top Go down

KUA schedule

Post  bb603 on Fri Nov 25, 2011 11:24 am

The KUA website shows:

14-17 Mon.-Thur. Fall Trimester Exams
17 Thursday Thanksgiving Vacation (after 10:00 a.m. exam)

bb603
Varsity
Varsity

Posts : 62
Join date : 2011-04-20

Back to top Go down

Re: Floras back in town

Post  Tuesday and Friday on Fri Nov 25, 2011 11:32 am

Some one told me Floras was back in Merrimack the weekend of November 11th to 13th.

Maybe he went back to KUA to take the finals the following week to finish off the trimester.

Tuesday and Friday
Moderator

Posts : 3866
Join date : 2009-10-12

Back to top Go down

Re: Floras back in town

Post  Tulliver on Fri Nov 25, 2011 11:39 am

I believe he did return to take exams and pack.

Tulliver
Moderator

Posts : 531
Join date : 2009-04-05

Back to top Go down

Re: Floras back in town

Post  Tuesday and Friday on Fri Nov 25, 2011 11:41 am

If that is true, then one would think it would clear up academic eligibility requirements in order to play athletically at Merrimack High.

Correct Tully?

Tuesday and Friday
Moderator

Posts : 3866
Join date : 2009-10-12

Back to top Go down

Re: Floras back in town

Post  Tulliver on Fri Nov 25, 2011 11:56 am

Don't know his grades or if the courses gel with merry's.
Too many personal variables

Tulliver
Moderator

Posts : 531
Join date : 2009-04-05

Back to top Go down

prep year then redshirt year

Post  bb603 on Fri Nov 25, 2011 1:13 pm

JAF - Good point on the roster for football. But looked into it further. The player did a year of prep school then a redshirt year.

I have nothing against this player. I do not know him personally, my son played a couple of sports agianst him over the years. From what I saw of him I have nothing but respect for him as a person and an athelete, but

I am just using him as an example to find out how far people think a kid should go to play sports in college.

Another example would be Jordan Leguerre from Trinity. He did 2 years of prep school. Did he go on to college?


Personally, if I could go back in time I would have my son do a redshirt/readiness year.

bb603
Varsity
Varsity

Posts : 62
Join date : 2011-04-20

Back to top Go down

Re: Floras back in town

Post  Tuesday and Friday on Fri Nov 25, 2011 2:18 pm

As far as Jordan Laguerre is concerned.... The following is from the UMass basketball web site concerning Laguerre:



On Laguerre:
NCAA Partial Qualifier, can practice with team but cannot play in games in 2011-12 ... Explosive guard that can get anywhere he wants on the court .... lightning quick on both ends of floor ... quick handle with array of finishes around the rim ... can make shots in bunches behind the arc ... creates space with good step-back in midrange situations ... relentless defender with super high motor.

Before UMass:
Played two seasons at the New Hampton School in New Hampshire ... Led New Hampton to a 21-12 record in 2010-11 and trip and a trip to the NEPSAC AAA title game ... Averaged 14 points per game as a junior in 2009-10 ... Played three years at Trinity High School, leading the Pioneers to a combined record of 55-6, including a 20-1 mark and league championship.

Tuesday and Friday
Moderator

Posts : 3866
Join date : 2009-10-12

Back to top Go down

Re: Floras back in town

Post  Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Page 2 of 5 Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

View previous topic View next topic Back to top


 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum